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Interview with Costel Bercus from Romania Costel Bercus is the President of the Board of the Roma Education Fund. He was the Executive Director of the Bucharest-based Roma nongovernmental organisation Romani CRISS and in that capacity he took a leading role in advocating school desegregation in Romania. Between 2005 and 2010, he was a member of the Roma Advisory Board of the Open Society Institute. The interviewers were Iulius Rostas, Mihai Surdu and Marius Taba. Question: Let us start the discussion with the issue of Roma education under communism and in the transition period. What was the education of Roma like during the communist period? What were its main characteristics? Costel Bercus: On the one hand, communism had quite a positive impact on the issue of Roma education. This favorable effect was due to the emphasis that the system of education placed on school attendance. The result was a high level of attendance of Roma children in mainstream schools. Also, there was a less overt level of discrimination that Roma had to face during communist times. This is the positive side. On the other hand, the access of young Roma to higher education was not as open as it is today. This is for various reasons. Why do a majority of Roma who graduate from secondary schools not go to universities? Besides the pre-school education, primary schools and secondary schools, Roma mainly chose vocational training, so it sooner had to do with the overall policy rather then discrimination based on ethnicity. It was mandatory for all children to be in the school system until the higher education level. Overall, this circumstance affected the education of Roma in a positive way. Today, the gap that exists between Roma and non-Roma is significantly wider than it used to be during communist times. 268 Ten Years After Q: Why do you think there were these positive and negative aspects ? What were the causes? C.B.: It was primarily the existing policy that education was mandatory for all children, no matter what their religious or ethnic background . If a child in that system failed to attend school, then a representative of the school—the principal or the headmaster—as required by the system, visited the family and handled that situation. The goal was to keep all children at school. It was in their job description, they were expected to visit the parents and to check why children failed to show up for two or three days. All this was ensured by the policy of those times. Today, no preventive measures similar to that are taken to ensure that children do not stay out of school. It was also a mean of social control , if you want. The schools and the teachers had to perform and to deliver quality education, as the Party emphasized the need to educate—that is, to indoctrinate —everybody. Q: Why do you think Roma had less or limited access to a higher education? C.B.: Well, I would not say it was only a Roma issue. In Romania, less than 5 percent of the population held a university degree at the fall of communism, according to the census from 1992. I think back then it was a larger social issue, but certainly most of the Roma were affected. A few Roma managed to go to universities, but most of them ended up receiving vocational training as there was a high demand for skilled labor. Most of them worked in large factories. From one point of view it was good because there was a guaranteed link between graduation and access to the labor market. It was part of the political system, based on the ideology that everyone should have a job and should work, and every graduate should be offered a job. There was also a clear obligation for all citizens, so to speak, even for those who had a low level of education. Such individuals were simply forced to achieve a minimum level of education and then go to work. Certainly, it was an easier way for Roma to find their place in society, especially following centuries of slavery, deportation and systematic exclusion. So, during communism, a certain number of Roma had the possibility to become part of the middle class, but not the nomenklatura. Q: You mentioned that the gap between Roma and non-Roma in education grew deeper during the transition period. What were the similarities and differences in education of Roma during communism and...

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